2009 Gold Buffalo Proof Coins
The US Mint has released information on the upcoming 2009 Proof Gold Buffalo coins. The coins will be available starting on October 29, 2009 at 12:00 Noon ET.
As known previously, only a single one ounce proof version of the coin will be offered. Last year, the US Mint had offered fractional versions of the coin (1/2 oz, 1/4 oz, 1/10 oz) and a full line of collectible uncirculated coins (1 oz, 1/2 oz, 1/4 oz, 1/10 oz). These products had been announced as discontinued in late 2008.
The one ounce 2009 Proof Gold Buffalo coins are struck in 24 karat gold. The obverse and reverse designs are based on the original 1913 Type I Buffalo Nickel by James Earle Fraser. The coins are minted at the West Point Mint and carry the "W" mint mark.
The price of the coin will be based on the tables available for the United States Mint's numismatic gold products. If the average weekly price of gold remains within the current range of $1,050 to $1,099.99, then the coins will be priced at $1,360.00 each.
The biggest revelation about the offering is that there will be no household ordering limits and no maximum mintage.
Yesterday when examining the bullion coin offering, I had stated that this would be key to the longer term prospects of the 2009 Proof Gold Buffalo. With unrestricted ordering and mintage, presumably for the next two months, the final mintage should easily exceed the low levels of 2008.
Undoubtedly this will be a popular offering, and the coin will be cherished by many collectors, but I don't think there will be a repeat of the incredible price appreciation experienced for last year's coins. The one ounce 2008 Proof Gold Buffalo currently sell for $2,600 or more on the secondary market.
Labels: Gold Buffalo
posted by Mint News Blog @ 7:24 AM
163 Comments:
Note: The price of gold is dropping. It is down 1% today. It might be worth waiting a week and see if the price will drop further before purchasing. It's very close to the threshold of dropping %50.
Okay, maybe the UHR will be the lowest mintage 1oz gold coin in 2009 after all!!! LOL
I wonder if the mint really can produce 80,000 of these if that many are ordered in the first 1-2 weeks, like with the bullion version. I'm skeptical, but they haven't made their mind up at any point during this year about how many coins to mint, so who knows!!
With no ordering limits and no maximum mintage, the rush towards these will likely not be as bad as previously anticipated.
Skid hit the nail on the head when suggesting that we give it a little time and see if the price will drop a tier in the near future. Of course, we have to trust the Mint not to cut these off early, despite the lack of limits. That would throw everyone a curve, and make a mad dash towards the product inevitable!
Brad , your 110% correct!
WTF?
Unlimited mintage?
SO can it top UHR >100K number?
I dunno but it seems although fewer pdts are produced this yr, they are all in ultra high numbers (UHN)
Incidentially, I recently returned my UHR coz I thot Proof buff maybe a better buy instead... now all bets are off.
Thanks Moy.
Did you know if you look up the word (incompetent:3 a : lacking the qualities needed for effective action b : unable to function properly) in the dictionary , there is a picture of Edmund C. Moy!!
The big issue isn't whether the Mint will "cut these off early", its how far into 2010 they will offer the 2009 coin.
I had planned on buying the proof Buffalo if there was a household limit...or more importantly, an overall mintage limit...but now...I don't think so
Let's all boycott the 2009 proof buff so that Moy can stick all the unsold coins up his a$$!!!
Me too; was thinking of getting a proof buff but now I'm not so sure... will probably just be paying a high price for a bullion coin
Authorized by Congress, commemorative coins typically celebrate and honor American people, places, historic events, and institutions. Surcharges from the sales of these coins help fund a variety of organizations and projects that benefit the community. Commemorative coins are only available directly from the United States Mint for a limited time.
Shouldn't they just say.Helps to make Mr Moy,Timothy Biedner and his friends pockets fatter
I'm looking forward to this release.
After reading this post , I'm scratching the Buff. off my list!!
If the 2009 Proof Buffalo comes in with a 100,000+ mintage, it will obviously only serve to further solidify the 2008's place as the key proof coin in the series.
Honestly, I don't understand why the 2007 Proof Buffalo doesn't command any additional premium over the 2006's, seeing as how the mintage is roughly only 1/4 that of the 2006! I know by the same token the 2007's mintage is roughly 2/3 higher than the 2008, but it still seems like it should have a value somewhere between the two. Maybe it will wake up someday and distance itself from the 2006. But for now, both coins can be had for around $300 over spot or less.
Any gold coin at 100K figures is not gonna to command any signigicant collectable value.
If 09 proof buffalo figures approach 07 numbers even, it's gonna be another bullion coin
Boycott the 2009 Proof Buffalo. Let Moy and his pals sit on them (literally) !
Mr Moy and Company seem to have hit on a formula. Beware. The Mint has been able to drum up demand with products only to around and open the flood gates and screw us.
Remember how only 100,000 LP1's were made only to turn around and sell 300,000 LP2's? Dropped the Harrison and Tyler Prez rolls to 30,000 only to raise it to who knows on the Polk dollars. Offer the 4 proof pennies in a set only to offer them by themselves later with no pre-announcement.
The 2008 low mintages of collector buffalo's sound like another set-up to me for 2009. Wouldn't surprise me if the Mint sold 300,000 Proof Buffs!
Well, not bullion value exactly. But, the magic of 2008 will certainly not repeat itself. For now, anyway.
The 2009 issue could be a tricky one to guage. It's possible that collectors who are still mourning the loss of a 2009 Gold Eagle Proof coin might buy themselves a 2009 Proof Buffalo as a sort of "make-do" coin, just so they can have SOME sort of proof coin this year. That might even serve to get a few collectors new to the Buffalo series to begin collecting it as well.
I regret now not investing in any of the Buffalo Proofs last year, opting instead to put all of my money for the Gold Buffalo series into the Uncirculated "W" 4-coin sets instead. I don't regret buying them in the slightest, but I wish I had alotted more funds to go to the Proofs as well. I really don't want to go back and get them now, but even at today's prices they are still very likely a bargain compared to what may lie ahead!
Breaking News? Looks like the Lincoln Chronicles set is no longer for sale!
FINALLY?
Dun cry over spill milk (2008 W Buff)
If you miss them , let it go .. there will be others in the future; just keep ur eyes open.
Never chase the mkt after it's gone; else you'll likely end up a sucker.
Better to be safe then a sucker IMO
I'm damned if I do and damned if I don't. That is the kind of luck I have!
If I buy a 2009 proof Buffalo, then the Mint will sell like 200,000 of them. If I don't buy one, then the Mint will sell about 20,000 of them. ARGGGG!!
The Mint's decision to concentrate only on production of 1 oz 2009 UHR and Buffalos proves that it has freed up resources to flood the international market with them.
At huge volumes like these, the greatest demand for "unique" buffalo and UHR American gold is in China, India and other international bullion markets. Big volumes will send the U.S. Mint big profits: UHRs were for fiscal year 2009 and Buffalos are for FY2010. (Federal fiscal year starts October 1st.)
Also may be part of a strategy to earn Moy a legacy among international mint operators before he leaves office. The Mint's intense UHR marketing program may have accomplished this legacy on its own... . Cranking out 200,000 buffalos in 2009, may just be international legacy insurance at the expense of U.S. collectors and loyal U.S. Mint customers.
Sad.
You are right my friend!!!
I'm out to get you !!!
hahaha... whatta gonna do now?
Everyone is worried because there's no true collecters out there... they are all worried about their investments in this
$H!T; if you a true collecter, buy what you think you will like , and forget about all the BS out there...!!!
Period!!!
Myself being a TRUE COLLECTOR, do not care if they make 10,000 or 1,000,000 it's a beautiful coin and there WILL be one in my collection.
I would mark the time at 12.00 pm est.Which in my opinion is one week exactly from when they actually finally sold out.Even though the mint did just announce it.Now you will see many people upset as they get the word that their Lincoln Chronicle set orders were cancelled.Another great job by our US Mint to up set many new coin collectors and reduce the number of new interested collectors.Some how I get the feeling they are planning all of this to keep people from hoarding until prices rise on gold and silver.
I cannot get the Mint's Pricing Grid to load. Is anyone else having this problem? Paranoia is setting in.
After seeing such a long period of allowed buffer orders(one week),It makes me wonder if mintage numbers are artificial.Is there some sort of way to find out legally if Mintage numbers are real? Or are we still supposed to just believe the US Mint who has been not forth right to us all year long.
From David C. Harper, Numismatic News
October 21, 2009 :The Lincoln Coin and Chronicles Set arrives this week with a sellout number of 51,000. That’s 1,000 over the maximum allowed, but not to worry. That will be whittled back to the 50,000 by the time all credit card and other problems are worked through.
In fact, the Mint was still taking standby orders to add to the waiting list for days after the official ceiling was reached.
If that's true (which you never know with the Mint) then they took about 15,000 orders too many?
I would be interested to know just how many Buffer orders were actually filled.Is there any statistics on this?If anyone ordered (Buffer Order) well in advance of the suspected sell out date(Last Friday).I think it would be interesting to see people who made these orders start announcing if their order was filled.
I'm sure were gonna see alot of people very ,very unhappy to say the least.
Well, the Lincoln Coin and Chronicles Set (LN6) "Sold Out".
Moving on ... anyone for 0 Proof Buff?
I'm in for one.
I was trying to decide on buying the bullion or the proof version. It looks like they will both be bullion now. I've suddenly lost interest in either.
I just started to collect coins for about four months. I'm ready for a 2009 proof Buffalo. This will be my second gold coin (first was 2009 UHR).
Welcome to the wonderful world of coin collecting:)
Welcome my friend...
I'm gonna #$%^& u up so bad.... lol
is there anywhere, or anyway to buy gold coins and make payments on them for poor people like me
HI Michael,
Where can I find info on the 09 Proof Buff. There seems to be no info avail at the Mint's website
Thanks
Who thinks that the Dec 3rd releases could be big winners for the year? Especially the 1 oz plantinum proof. I hope that one satisfies. I want one and it would be my 1st 1 oz platinum product. I just hope spot prices don't get too high!
Ok, whoever keeps posting comments as "Moy" please note, it's not funny anymore. Anyone second that?
Note that Products released in Dec can well sell into 2010;
Another thing... do we know the confirmed design on the Plat Eagle yet?
hmn... to 12:06
Why are you concerned? unless ur MOY?!?!
No, I'm not Moy. It's just getting a little old now. At first it was funny, but it has since just become stupid. I'm sure I'm not the only one who is tired of it now.
Let's face it, the Mint hasn't followed legislated requirements or time frame trends for most of its recent product lines. Given the events of the last 12+ months, I am not going to be blinded by their "no mintage or ordering limits" disclaimer.
Previous posts already have referenced LP1 vs. LP2 and the Presidential Dollar Coins. Other examples include the First Spouse Gold Coins: haven't met legislated sales since Madison and earlier; extended Monroe past one year; took Jackson down after 10 months.
But the worst and most recent example was the 2008 PR and UNC Buffalo Programs that offered multitudes of products and no published limits. After five months of slightly higher gold prices and a mediocre response, the 2008 Buffalo Program was done. The Community was left in shock.
Keep in mind that, like the previous, these 2009 Proofs are not legislated. So, is the Mint running this line as a favor to the clientele? In my opinion, hardly!! This is about fast sales and profit margins. I intend to add one of these to my collection and, like the majority, I will monitor gold prices for the best price to make it happen. Given the Mint's recent history of non-compliance and unpredictability, I won't too long for that extra $50 break to appear. Best of luck to all!!
INFO FOR THE 2009 BUFFALO
.
http://www.usmint.gov/pressroom/index.cfm?action=press_release&ID=1074
The feedback was sensible and useful before the Moy comments/invective began to appear. Will have to move on.
I still can't make up my mind on whether to go for the proof buff now that mintages may end up quite high...
Just dun like to spend too much money buying a bullion coin when I can get them years later and much lower prices when all this rush cools off.
Yeah, that's true. Just keep an eye on the sales levels and do whatever makes you most comfortable.
A little off the Buffalo topic, but did anyone else notice that the Mint has already lifted the order limits on the Braille Education set?
Yeah, I saw that. They probably were disappointed to see an influx of cancellations from Lincoln Chronicles buyers who were banking on a sellout. When the new statistics showed that less than 4,000 sets sold last week, the set has undoubtedly been deemed a secondary market failure. It will probably only be good as a novelty item in the future.
Is it true that any unsold Braille coins (and sets?) will be destroyed at the end of the year? That's what the National Federation of the Blind is saying: http://www.nfb.org/nfb/Braille_coin.asp
If so, wouldn't it be a low end mintage at this rate?
That's because the know it is a flop.Now they are hoping the TV shopping networks will buy them out.LOL
If the US Mint had any smart PR Executives.They would run TV ads to promote their products.Sell outs would be much faster and profits would be much higher.Even after paying for the TV advertising spots.But why should anyone assume that the US mint has smart Executives based on current and past events.
Low mintage does not garantee high value; there must be demand
The braille coins looking the way they are will not have much demand even if the Mint just make 1000 of them.
There are many low mintage coins around the world; many much much better looking than the Braille - but they are still priced as bullion coz there no demand
Low mintage does not garantee high value; there must be demand
The braille coins looking the way they are will not have much demand even if the Mint just make 1000 of them.
There are many low mintage coins around the world; many much much better looking than the Braille - but they are still priced as bullion coz there no demand
Just when I read it the first time.It looked the same again.LOL
Does anyone have an idea of the weight that the mint put on a single package containing one COIN and Chronicle set.The reason I ask is because I made multiple orders and they shipped it by it self which was good.The bad part is they did not describe to me which package is which and as usual I have no email from them giving me the info.Par for the course US Mint.Thanks so much for that great service all year LOL.So if anyone has the weight of that box which shows up on the fed ex on line tracking number.I would appreciate it.
1.2 lbs/0.5 kg
I got 1.3 lbs/0.6 kg for LCC set only.
Maybe the weight varies based on how much of that silly wadded up paper they stuff inside! :)
Thanks a lot guys.At least I know it won't be the boxes that weighs 2.6 lbs.LOL
Funny. As anyone noticed the picture they use for the 2009 gold buffalo proof is not an actual coing but an artist's rendering? Kinda makes one think none of these have even been struck yet!
Wow, I can't spell today.
I think ALL the pictures the Mint posts of coins are artists' renderings. I can't recall ever seeing a picture of an actual coin on their site, now that you mention it.
I have never bot a buffalo coin as yet;
Question to those of you owning a bullion and proof 1oz Buffalo
Which actually looks better on hand?
I'm getting the impression that the Bullion buffalo looks more like a gold coin on hand?
Thanks
Similar to all coins, I think the proof version looks nicer than the bullion, simply due to the contrast between the frosted image and mirrored background.
But again, it could simply be a matter of preference. Others might feel the uncirculated (bullion) version looks better.
I second the motion. Anyone posting here under the name of Moy needs to get a life.
The 2009 proof buff will definitely be in my collection. I pick at least one up from the Mint each year. I’m still debating on whether or not to go out in the secondary market to pick up one of the 2008 uncirculateds. If we all had that crystal ball we’d know exactly which ones to pick up when they’re offered.
Given all the gold coin options available and a budget of five thousand dollars which ones seem like the better buys...
Investors start your calculations.
Which gold coins are likely to be the sleepers?
Willy
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I'm kinda on the fence. I can pick up a 1 oz 2008 w uncirculated for about 2500 or a 2009 proof for 1400... not sure which...
I think that these will command a huge premium as soon as they are sold out...whenever that occurs. We have to put things into perspective this year. The US Mint canceled almost everything. With the proof Buffalo being one of the only few options, we are in uncharted waters. I think these coins will be decent regardless of mintage. Will they double like the 08s,....I think they will, but we'll have to wait untill they sell out. If nothing else, I believe the gold spot will double in the next year or two :)
I think gold is more likely to be at $850/oz than $2000/oz in the next year or two.
TO 8:54pm
I will enter a contract to buy all your gold at 850/oz at 1 or 2 years from today.
If ur sure of Gold's drop, u had better sell me ur gold.
Wow. Reading some of these comments are frightening. There are a lot of fraudulent coin collectors on here if you ask me. Many of you seem to "collect" with stress and misery. I'm glad I collect what I enjoy...
What's next? Blame Mint Director Ed Moy because the price of gold drops? lol
Yup, dun blame me!
It amazes me that people get in the mindset that gold only goes up. Hello, didn't the recent stock market crash and real estate bubble burst teach you anything? I am not saying that gold can not go higher, but trust me when I say it surely can go lower.
Your mentality of "I will enter a contract to buy all your gold at 850/oz at 1 or 2 years from today" suggest to me that you are not thinking with your head. Precious metals go up And they go down. I don't know when gold is going to peak, but I can assure you that it is closer now than it was a year or two ago. Just be careful.
The alternative is the once-might dollar and it hit its peak 20 years ago. Based on the printing presses running 24/7 since January, I think gold looks better in the long run. At least its value is not tied to the crazy inclinations of a corrupt government. I might add that China will buy my gold from me, but they won't buy my dollars.
Gold at 850/oz, I will buy too...
You got to look at the big picture and macro outlook.
Of coz all prices can go up and down but gold priced in terms of USD at 850/oz, I'll take it.
hahaha..
Definately the one not thinking rite is someone sell gold at 850/oz 1-2 year out now...
I will take it anytime now and hedge it outright and lock in the profit; nevermind the eventual price...
If you are going to invest in gold.You better have a good knowledge of the difference between a bull and a bear
2 years ago, nobody knew the price of gold would increase so rapidly... because so many things have happened since then that lead to the price increase. At the same time, things can happen and 2 years from now gold can be at a lower price.
You can make all the wise cracks about the weakness of the dollar all you want, but the truth it that a balloon bursts in a lot less time than it takes to fill one up. Gold is no exception.
It takes longer for a bull to run up hill then it does for a bear to run down hill
Make all the wise cracks you want. But only a fool "knows" what the price of gold is going to do. If you are so sure that gold is going to be 2000/oz in one to two years, then I would say get a second mortgage on your home and buy all the gold you can! The rest of us hedge our bets and buy a little here and there.
All I said is that gold is more likely to go lower than it is to hit 2000/oz. A fool and their money are soon parted. Buy everything you can right now at $1050/oz. Not me. Go back and look at the historical charts of gold.
Gold hit $750/oz in 1978. It hit $300/oz in 1999. Gold hit 1000/oz in 2008. Later in 2008 it was in the $700s.
I don't know what gold is going to do so don't act like you know either!
Ever wonder why China puts a Panda bear on their gold coins and the USA puts a buffalo with horns on theirs HMMMMM!!!!!
hmmm, because Pandas live in China and Buffalos live in the USA perhaps?
This is not 1978. We have an extremely socialist government that is intentionally trying to destroy the dollar. They will also be in office for another year+ to do even more damage. The printing presses are operating non-stop and are probably smoking. This same government is also attacking the private sector and NOBODY is safe. They are instituting wage controls, wanting to control the internet, healthcare, etc. Everyone can see what's going on, and only a "fool" ignores it or tries to compare today with 30 years ago.
I will not be mortgaging my home to buy gold, but I also recognize that the dollar is going to go down hard. I am merely exchanging dollars for gold as I am able. I do not exchange for the purpose of watching gold go to $2K/ounce, but to protect (to the degree that I am able) my capital. Simple as that.
The gold buffalo also happens to be one of the nicest coins made by the US Mint (IMO)...especially based on what is coming out of the Mint these days. Therefore, I will just kill two birds with one stone and buy buffs as I can afford to.
With all of the people who are out of work and lost all they had it is sickening to read all of these posts.
I read about people who have the money to throw around for a coin that others need to save thier homes from being forclosed. The money spent on that coin could feed a starving family for a long time.
Take the money you have to throw around and help those around you. After that then buy the coin because you think it is beautiful. We as a country will never get out of the hole we are in unless we start to think of those around us and stop worring about what a coin will do to help you become richer.
Obviously you don't remember the late 70's and the conditions that existed then.
Gold is a good investment, but when you start reaching the peak you need to becareful. I know you don't want to hear anything other than gold is going higher and higher. Dismiss my warnings at your own peril.
Should we as a nation be more charitable, perhaps. But don't come on here trying to guilt people for buying coins. Jeez.
As for the socialist goverment we have now. The dollar tied a 14 month low this week before rebounding. Who was in office 14 months ago?
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I think gold will peak at 2k and then fall and hover around 1200 for a while. I don't think we'll see prices less than 700 again. The way I look at gold is I want to preserve wealth, regardless if it goes up or down, its gonna be worth something when I need it. I think we can all agree that we'll never be tossing gold on the streets like garbage. I don't really mind taking a 300 dollar hit if it should go back down because that outweighs the risk of it going up. I also think buying numismatic and/or rare coins help prevent a huge loss. I'm considering the 2009 proof buffalo, 2008 uncirculted buffalo, and the fractional coins as my next purchase. I think the fractional coins may have the best upside because you can get a bigger premium on a smaller coin.
It may take awhile, but WHEN the economy gets rolling again, and it will, the price of gold will drop as it always has.
China’s growing appetite for gold is a powerful trend that will benefit gold investors for years – even decades – to come.
China has decided to take out it's investments in US Bonds and replace them with the euro and India holdings.Is this not an indication that China is about to overtake India as the worlds largest gold reserve holder.
This country better wake up quick and realize that gold is now and for the long term going to be one of the best investments to make.
I also like the lithium market which is supposed to triple in the next five years.This market has already tripled in 2 years.
Because of the large investment of infrastructure in China.It would also be a very wise move to look at our country revitalize our steel mills based on infrastructure demands on Iron ore.
If we don't get smart and stop being a service nation only.Our country may see very dark days ahead.
It may take awhile, but WHEN the economy gets rolling again, and it will, the price of gold will drop as it always has.
---------------------------
Be prepared to wait a LONG while; dun not underestimate this credit contraction on both consumer and commercial front - the boom you have seen the last 15-20 yrs fueled by easy credit and housing boom GONE. If u look at historical cycles of credit and debt... look closer... u simply do not know what ur talking abt. U need to look at the big picture!!
It is obvious that you only see what is happening in the USA.I think looking at the big picture is looking at world holdings and markets.Not just what is happening in the USA
I believe gold is a bubble waiting to burst. Can it go higher in the short-term. Definetly. Can it all burst quickly? Oh yes. All I am saying is becareful. If you think gold can only go higher you are headed for a fall.
All commodities are cyclical. Gold is no exception to the rule. If you don't want to hear the truth, then you won't hear it. To think that gold will not correct itself is plain foolish. I am looking at the big picture, it is you that have blinders on.
I am based in Asia now(coz this is where the opportunities are ) and I am looking at the global macro picture for my analysis. If ur in U.S. and still thinking U.S. eco is gonna snap back like the 80s and USD is a safe haven like it was, be my guest.
I'm just thinking ahead; having moved out of the States 3 yrs ago.
Nothing goes straight up.
But ride the trend while it last; and dun bother guessing where the top is like so many here are worried that gold is in a bubble.
Dun chase the price; but buy the dips, esp if ur selling against USD
Bull markets ride a wall of worries... like the people here; worrying about the gold bubble bursting.
You are probably looking at the wrong directions... if u prefer to hold USD instead
You're right. The United States sucks. The dollar will be worthless. Buy Gold, Buy Gold, Buy Gold. Buying Gold makes the sky clear and the birds sing! Gold, gold, gold.
Oh wait, the US ecomony could rebound. Oh wait, gold production is up 5-10%. Oh wait, 900 tons of gold was reintroduced to the market last year from people selling their personal gold. Gold is up 50% over the price of oil this year. Maybe Gold is tapped out?
I really doubt that anyone here is going to change anyones political outlook on the price of gold or world economic policies. The real question is, Will the Proof Gold Buffalo command real premiums right now! If you are just collecting a beautiful coin, then none of this matters at all, but I personally like to collect beautiful coins by selling beautiful coins to pay for my beautiful coins. If I can sell 4 Gold proof Buffalos and make $300 each, then I can basically get one for my own collection...I know, I know...capitalism at its best...Its worked for me in the past. I'm betting that it will work again. By the way, I think some of the bloggers are right about the new Gold Bubble, and I think it will burst and correct too. Right around the time it gets to about $4K to $5K. Happy Blogging!
If you had $10k to invest on physical gold, would you buy gold 09 proof buffalos, 09 fractional gold eagles, 09 buffalo bullion, UHR, or a little bit of all of them. Need advice, Thanks.
I would go for the 1oz Platium Eagle. Everyone is overlooking it.
Their is no question that gold will be in a bubble but we have only slowly begun that proces....A bubble is when you are at a cocktail party or at a restaurant and all people are taking about is gold, just like they did for real estate and the teck stocks. We are slowly seeing folks recognize gold as an asset and even if 20% of the population made 5%- 10% of their portfolio in gold or especially silver the price will sky rocket. With regards to Numismatics, we saw how well they kept their price when gold hit $750and silver hit $9.00. They still did great and especially anthing that was 2008.
If these buffalo are minted like the UHR's then we will have the same scenario but as many bloggers have pointed out, god only knows how many of these the mint will make.
To 9:20 AM it depends if you are investing in coins or gold. I personally would look at the population stats/mintages/projected quantities (for 2009), and buy the lower pops at 70 grade. Just coming out of the gate they should be cheaper than buying later, after they have marinaded in the market a while as known rarities.
$10,000
Here's what I would do.
1 Gold Proof Buff
1 UHR
1 1oz Gold Eagle bullion
5 1/2oz Gold Eagle Bullion
5 1/4oz Gold Eagle Bullion
5 1/10oz Gold Eagle Bullion
Anything left over...I'd buy a massage.
Personally, I would avoid buying the graded gold coins and instead spend all of the alotted budget on raw coins. "70" graded coins DO sell for more, but they COST a lot more to acquire too (unless you submit your own raw coins for grading).
Buying raw coins will allow you to get more of the actual gold metal for the same money you would spend on graded coins. JMO
If you are a collector, really like the buffalo proof coin, and can afford it then I say buy one. If you are just an investor then buy at your own risk and don't cry if the value drops. If I can make it work I will buy one. I like the buffalo coins and wish they would make them in silver. Its a uniquely American coin. I don't particulary care for the way the mint operates now but I don't have much say over that other than writing my congressman.
I never buy graded coins (imo they are just con jobs)
But I do only buy coins direct from the Mint and authorized dealers only.
What amazes me is all the first strike and early release coins I see by PCGS and NGC.When by clear view of the coin it is very apparent that most of them look like late stage strikes.This clearly proves that not only do these companies cater to the bulk dealers who pay bigger bucks for such labels.But it also puts out a message that buying any graded coin from these scum bags is nothing but a gimmick.Buy from the Mint if you want a newer gold ounce coin.Not from these punks who take advantage of unknowing buyers.Bullion coins are bought in bulk.There is no way to tell which was struck first or released first other then a shipping date.Furthermore,most bulk coins are and never will be in my opinion worthy of the high grades I see these companies give them.Your much better off putting your money into a older gold double eagle then buying the junk they produce today.
Authorized dealers are the ones buying this junk and putting first strike and early release labels on them.It's a racket,a gimmick,a scam.GET IT!!!!!!
Which is nicer to own a proof or Bullion buffalo?
Anyone?
Oh my god, how many times are we going to have to read that question?
Clearly in my opinion it would be the proof because that is direct from the US Mint and hasn't changed many hands by dealers and graders.Plus I believe the proof is a much more beautiful coin showing more definition with contrasts between the frosted devices and the mirrored back ground.I think the proof will also hold a much higher value based on the lower mintage if that does occur this year which I think is a high probability.But in my opinion I won't buy either because I believe the price on both are just way to high.I'll buy double eagles instead.
Good to see so many who disavow the marketing antics and hype of the likes of PCGS. I agree: direct from the mint purchases are best, and especially nice are the flawless ones. I do have a loupe and microscope and like to scan for gems. I'm planning on having a lot of fun with my purchase of 5 mint sets - all those coins to look at closely and make notes +++ !
Time for a rant!
I like some proof versions better than the bullion versions. However, I like the look of the bullion buffalo better than the proof buffalo. To me, the bullion buffalo has a gritter look to it which, IMHO, is more fitting for the style of the design. The proof is a little gaudy. With that being said, though, I do plan to purchase an '09 proof. A collection is a collection.
To Anonymous at 10:18,
Wow! You said the magic word that has been lost by so many over the years in all of the "wheeling & dealing" and "how much profit can we turn on this stuff" mentalities...you plan to have FUN with your coin purchases!
That's what it REALLY is about in coin collecting, isn't it? When you break it down to it's most basic quality?
Good for you!
Happily surprised to have my Lincoln Chronicles order that was not until am Oct. 16 go from BackOrder to In Stock/Reserved to Shipped to today.
Michael, Thank you for this great Blog and for all the hard work you put into it. So unfortunate that instead of coins, the discussion has to usually always bring in politics. I really hope it never gets to the point where you quit and this forum disappears.
Coinage is all about politics; as is the demise of the US $. When China elects to put 63 cents of their trade surplus in Euros since June 2009 - that's telling us (US) that we had better take America back (can't keep up these defecits and taxing the people to redistribute our wealth to ACORN) We can play this international game too: quickly switch to the gold standard and tie one buschel of wheat to one barrel of sweet crude oil. The old greenback circulating will be worthless fiat. The USA can be self sufficent trading within its own boarders (keep the illegals out)and bring the US economy back by reducing the tax burden, and storing our wealth backed by our GOLD reserves (our gold certificates do not leave our shores).
I'm buying a 2009 Proof because it's a beautiful coin and I don't think that there will be too many people who can afford one this year. The value will be there. Give the UHR time - its value will come around also because of it being a one year coinage.
AMEN!
Ha, you don't know? Taking delivery of metals makes you an enemy of the state!
No. Taking delivery of metals and ripping off your fellow statesmen by putting first strike ms70 makes you an enemy of the state.
No, anyone who takes delivery is an enemy of the state. Notably, if you take delivery the state cannot use it in its paper market.
Bowtie, I'm tired of your brainless comments. Try really hard to leave an intelligent comment or get out of here......
or else?
Normally I prefer the Proof versions of each coin, but I would have to go with the Unc./Bullion version of the Buffalo. I don't care too much for the unsmooth background. I find it distracting. The first time that I saw a proof buff. I thought that it had flaws.
The things to look at on buying this proof:
Many are not wanting to pay the added premium (based on earlier posts here).
2008 mintage was extremely low in part due to the mimt screwing with the supply (look at last year's posts on the Buff.) They had very difficult time keeping the supply available. Do you really think that they have solved this problem? If so, sign me up for a couple dozen proof ASEs.
This guy is hitting the market very late in the year. If they decide to cut off sales on Dec. 31, you will have an instant winner. If not, prepare for some serious whining on this blog.
A lot of people have spent or will spend their coin budget on the UHR Eagle.
We are still in a deep recession...people just don't have the money.
Some people will hold off until the price of gold drops to save a few $$$s. If gold does rise as the crystal ball bloggers above forecast, these people may very well be shut out.
In case you haven't noticed, I think there will be a pretty low mintage on these, and next year's market for them will be hot. If not, I hope that spot gold goes up to $1400/oz. to recover my investment.
I disagree with the last post predicting a low mintage of the 2009 Proof Buffalo. I think it will be over 100,000 because....1. No proof eagles. 2. No household limit nor overall limit...which tells me the Mint is well positioned in .9999 blanks to make a lot of these.
3. A lot of people might buy hoping for a repeat of 2008 prices in the secondary market...which will not happen. 4. There are not any fractional proofs and no uncirculated "W" coins at all.
Of course, I think sales in the first week will give us a fairly good idea of the demand of this coin. I'd be surprised if the first weeks sales is under 25,000...but time will tell.
I think the mintage on the 2009 Proof Buffalo's will far surpass the huge mintage of the UHR's.
The mint put limits on the UHR, and they have made over 100,000 of them already. No limits at all on the buffalo suggests they are ready for an even higher mintage for it.
The UHR is pretty much a dud, with little hope of ever increasing in value due to its huge mintage. The 2009 Proof Buffalo appears to be headed for the same pathetic fate. I believe they are going to make a TON of these, and will likely sell them well into 2010. (knowing the mint, they will then probably cancel 2010 buffalo's just out of spite!)
2009: The year the Mint didn't hardly make any coins, but the ones it did make had such a huge mintage they are pretty much worthless!
I won't be surprised if the Buffalo proof sells 80,000 the first week, like the bullion version. I expect it will be more like 50,000 though just because they are priced $300 over spot. From there, the mintage will explode... especially if gold prices dip down.
WOW... it's probably not coins ur collecting...if mintages or how others will view ur coin matters so much to you.
Buy if u will like it; and dun buy if u won't like it.
If you like to speculate- go speculate in the stock markets or if u like commodities, go speculate in Gold or crude futures.
Sorry, but I don't have enough money to just "buy" a gold coin cause I like it. I have to pick and choose WHICH gold coin will be the best "investment" for me. We all have our preferences, so don't come down on people like that. I invest in stocks too!
I don't think the UHR is a "dud" coin. True, the mintage has passed the 100,000 mark. But, it's a one-year only "type" coin with worldwide appeal. Raw specimens sold on eBay can still fetch as much or more as the price the Mint is now selling them for.
High mintage does not necessarily kill value, if enough people remain interested in the coin. Look at the 2006 Buffalo Gold Proof coin. It's mintage is around 252,000, and it still routinely sells for $1,300-$1,350 today. Considering that it's issue price was only $800, that is a pretty nice return on a 3-year investment! I wish now I had bought more of them back in 2006!
Stevieladeek said...
Sorry, but I don't have enough money to just "buy" a gold coin cause I like it. I have to pick and choose WHICH gold coin will be the best "investment" for me. We all have our preferences, so don't come down on people like that. I invest in stocks too!
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IF you dun have enough money to buy a gold coin; u probably shouldn't be investing in the stock mkt imo.
Exactly rite!
Learn how to read...I didn't say I didn't have the money to buy a gold coin...I said I didn't have the money to buy just ANY gold coin. I pick and choose which ones to buy.
Don't let them bother you, "Stevieladeek". The guy who said you shouldn't be investing in the stock market is probably the same guy who kept posting comments as "Moy" for a few days. And the "Exactly rite!" reply was probably him also, just trying to make it appear that others support his silly ideas! You probably have 10 times as much money as he has! He doesn't sound intelligent enough to hold down much of a job.
Hey! Gold ask is around $1,044! If it will only stay at that level or lower through Wednesday morning, we might see a $50 price drop this week!
let's keep our fingers crossed till Thurs. Things are looking good thou' going into Month end with options expiration.
Most people who sound intelligent are probably not intelligent from my experience - just look at our politicians!
I agree with the previous posters.
Simply put, if you are strapped for cash, you probably aren't fit to be a collecter (at least in expensive gold coins)
Maybe Stevieladeek should pick a collecter hobby that's within his budget. (silver or normal coins, stamps etc)
I like the way everyone "hides" behind "anonymous"
Intelligent comeback, Bowtie.
Is the State monitoring your Internet usage?..........
It looks like I won't be buying my Proof Buffalo coin this week. The average of London Fix Prices is too tantalizingly close to the $1,049.99 mark needed for a $50 price drop for me to order this week.
The am fix today was $1,040.75. But, the average of the fixes since last Thursday's am fix is still $1,054.36. With only two more fix prices to include in this week's calculation, it does not appear too likely that the average will get quite low enough to trigger a price decrease.
But, I will still wait until next week and continue to track the average price. With no mintage or order limits, I'm confident that the coins will NOT sell out this week. Since the possibility of a price decrease soon far outweighs that of a price increase, I really have nothing to lose by waiting. I place no value on the silly "First Strike" nonsense, so only the eventual sellout poses any danger to me.
The London pm gold fix price came in at $1,036.50. The average now stands at $1,052.13. In order for the Mint to lower prices by $50 this week, the am fix on 10/28 must be at or lower than $1,032.75.
Let's all hope for it!
If you want to have fun collecting Buffaloes, stick with 2008-W.
It is a proven success. Buy as many 2008 as you can afford now. In a couple of yrs, sell some to pay for your 2009 and maybe 2010.
There will be plenty of 2009, you don't need to rush.
Buffalos will have to wait for me till next week. I don't see gold moving much higher so I can get a better price once the buffalos are lower next week.
Absolutely right! The Mint got out of having to do a price decrease this week because the average from Thursday AM to Wednesday AM was $1,050.28. If both fixes hadn't been over $1,061 last Friday, the prices would have been lowered this week.
Gold down to $1031 today.
Is there a 3 leg variety for that much?
2009 American Buffalo One Ounce Gold Proof Coin (BA9)
Price: $1,360.00
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SO anyone buying today?
Not me!
I will wait until next week. Even with a big ($17) move today, gold spot still below $1,050. The chances of the average price staying below $1,050 are good enough to hold off. Even if gold spikes above $1,050, the chances of it going > $1,100 in a week seem very small, indeed.
If you have not ordered you are probably too late.
I believe these are very close to being sold out.
Michael,
What do you want to bet the Mint stops selling the Buffalo proofs the first week of Nov. I bet they have a certain number blanks on reserve just for them and I bet its under 25,000. They still have the 2009 AGE and the fractionals to make in Nov thru Dec. The demand is still a little high for the AGE 2009's and the fractionals will be through the roof. I have to get me a few plats proofs too :). I'm going to be broke by Christmas..lol
It's November 7, 2009 -
Has anyone reeived their order yet?
How many did you order?
When did you order?
When did you receive them?
I completed an order within the first 10 minutes on October 29 (by 1210 Eastern time) - item was on 'hold' through today, today US Mint states my order is 'reserved'.
I'm concerned that the US Mint will play games by delaying shipping and up-price me due to increases in price (from LME fix increases). They present us with so many problems - should be outsourced a la the Canadian Mint.
Once you have placed an order, the US Mint will not increase your price- even if the coin actually ships when higher prices are in place.
as of 11/11/09
AM gold fix = $1114.50
GAB Proof coin = $1360.00
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Net premium = $245.50
The mint's premium doesn't look so bad now
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