US Mint Authorized Purchaser List
The US Mint has provided an updated list of authorized purchasers. There are some changes from a list provided by the Mint last week.
For current and future reference, listed below are the 11 primary distributors of United States Mint bullion products who are able to purchase directly from the Mint:
A-Mark Precious Metals (Los Angeles) Gold, Silver, Platinum
Coins 'N Things (Massachusetts) Gold, Silver, Platinum
MTB (New York) Gold, Silver Platinum
Scotia Mocatta (New York) Gold, Silver, Platinum
American Precious Metals Exchange, Inc. (Oklahaoma) Silver
Dillon Gage Incorporated of Dallas (Texas) Silver
Prudential Securities Inc. (New York) Gold, Silver, Platinum
The Gold Center (Illinois) Silver
Jack Hunt Coin Broker (New York) Silver
Commerzbank (New York) Gold, Silver
Fidelitrade (Delaware) Silver
There is also some new information on the distribution of the America the Beautiful Silver Bullion Coins. So far, the primary distributors have ordered only 75,000 of the total 165,000 coins available.
Each of the 11 primary distributors were provided with an allocation of 3,000 coins per design, or 15,000 coins total. It looks like only five of them have placed an order with the US Mint for their allocation, and the remaining six are opting out of the program or still evaluating their options. They will have until the end of the week to place their order, or the excess coins will be reallocated to the active dealers the following week.
Separately, a new weekly US Mint numismatic products sales report is available.
Labels: US Mint
posted by Mint News Blog @ 2:43 PM
164 Comments:
2009 Silver Proof Set 299,178 - Love It!
So, does the USMint have to have these sold to the APs by the end of the year, or did they just have to have them made by the end of the year?
In theory, a person should be able to get five sets total at this point. 25-30 sets if using the friends and family plan.
Is this what the US Mint had in mind when changing the ground rules? I mean, what is to stop someone from going to all 5 APs that have bought them and getting a set from each one. And like the previous poster said, depending on family and friend helping you out, the whole lot could go pretty quick. 1650 people could easily get 20 sets each and there goes all the bullion coins.
Fidelitrade is taking names so they are one of the APs who ordered.
No plan was going to be perfect so let's just be happy with this. Next you guys are going to complain that the coins aren't all MS70.
5 getting 3000 sets, that leaves all 5 getting 3600 sets next week if they want.
Wait...they're not going to be all MS70s?...I'm out.
So, WHICH of the 5 will be getting them? And are they taking orders?
So far, Apmex (presumably) and Fidelity (confirmed) are in the group. Haven't heard the other three.
APMEX says this when I look at their site.
(Sold Out 1,000 sets in 19 Hours) Please set an Alert Me for when we are able to sell more...
The much anticipated Unite... view more
Average Rating
Availability: 12/17/2010
So does this mean they will go back on sale Friday?
For 5:07 PM - Bullion must be sold and shipped by year end. This year, looks like that last business day will be December 30th. New Year's Day is on Saturday; the 31st is a Federal Holiday. 3 days left for the APs to buy in; 15 calendar days left to buy and ship 165,000 bullion coins to the APs who are interested.
I'm wondering how many sets out of the 1000 sold by APMEX where multiple orders? I sure would hate to have to sort that big mess out.
The US Mint had ample time to have these coins out sooner. Why they chose to do this at years end only makes me believe it was a planned deal to maximize profits when silver spot price was it's highest.
Now all the APs are left trying to shuffle these out in record time. So my question is this. If they are not all sold by years end. Does the US Mint have to melt them or will they just stamp them with a P and call them numismatic versions in 2011?
This also raises the question of what mintage will be lower. These bullion coins or the numismatic versions. The APs could literally screw the US Mint by ordering less then 27000 of these coins in effect making these bullion versions a lower mintage then the US Mint wanted.
My grandfather always said to be careful what you wish for. The APs could actually screw Ed Moy by doing this. Isn't it amazing how greed has ruled all the goings on with this whole mess of a situation.
"2009 Silver Proof Set 299,178 - Love It!"
well yes, but it's the DC/US Territories Silver PF SET.
And yes, it was a decent value especially when silver made it's run.
And yes, it was very much a sleeper for a mint set. IMO
Has grandpa chimed in on what we should do?
Are the APs that sign up for the initial allocation required to buy the remaining allocations that will become available on the 20th? Can an AP decline and what happens in that case?
I don't think they're required to buy them. I wonder what the Mint would do with any unsold inventory?
I'll bet that the ones who are buying them will pony up the money for the rest when they are allowed to.
"Can an AP decline and what happens in that case?"
Would you decline an instant $225,000 profit (plus shipping and handling) to receive and ship 3000 sets of coins? Ain't gonna happen.
Just spoke to Fidelitrade.They took my name,phone and e-mail address.They said they will call when they set up their "program" to distribute the coins to the public. They are limiting it to ONE COIN not SET per household.
The "one coin" rule better not be from the Mint. That might actually be worth getting upset about.
The re-designed Mint website is online..........
OK, you want me to chime in what I'm doing about the 5 oz. offering? Perhaps you might have missed it since there has been a high volume of opinions and posts over the past several days. I've made my choice, plain and simple: I am NOT buying into this series, individually, or by sets. I don't want to pontificate but this fiasco is the latest of a long line of miscues and ill planned actions foisted upon the Mint's customer base. I choose not to support this obvious degregation of a hobby I've enjoyed for almost 50 years. Each to his own, if you want to see this continue, then buy into it. No improvement will be made, it surely will only get worse. Besides, the Mint is being operated by a shister eliment who thinks their customer base are imbecilles. Do I sound bitter? Not really, I am disappointed to see another formerly great activity descend into the abyss of embarrassment. Truly sorry, ~ Grandpa
Oh wow! If the Mint's rule is one coin per household, and not one set per household, that's gonna kill any interest in collecting the series. If I have to buy 4 out of the 5 at inflated prices, forget it. Or it will just inspire people to sign up their sisters, brothers, uncles, cousins, neighbors.
I did that once when the PO had a lottery for some error stamps. The order I sent in my secretary's name didn't get one, and when the PO refunded the money, her parents cashed the check and kept it! Good thing it was just $7 or so.
I'm sure that the fidelitrade rep was mistaken about the one coin per HH. Its specifically states one coin of each design per HH by the US Mint mandate. They pretty much have to follow that Mandate...they can't just make up their own rules on this offering.
Dear Grandpa- We are really glad that you were able to collect during the glory days. Your attitude really serves the next generation of collectors. Nothing like a morale booster....Not.
On the new mint web site, if you click on buffalo it brings up quarters,whats up with that?
There was a comment on one of the related blog topics that indicated Fidelitrade had stated that the Mint was imposing some "new" rules. Better not be 1 coin per HH.
When they said a new website, I thought they meant a new website! It's the same 90s website with a new color scheme and logo. Oh look, they added a drop down box too! Wow! Such epic features!
I saw that about the Buffalo, too. A brand new website, and it's already malfunctioning. The old one was better!
By the way, the Buffalo Proof coin can be found under the "Product Index" link, buried down there somewhere.
Are they ever going to fix the "My Account" link?
If the Mint is stupid enough to say now that the limit is one coin per household, then they just slit their own throats. No one is going to want to fool with such a hassle.
This year's mintage of 33,000 each would be the HIGH mintages, not the lows. Interest in the series would be next to nil, and future years won't even need 10,000 of each design. Of course, that then might turn it around again and make the coins highly desirable.
Collectors are a funny, fickle bunch!
Commerzbank opted out of the atb bullion program, I guess that means someone else will pick up the extra allotment.
So if you could only pick one design which one would you pick?
Probably Mount Hood.
Yellowstone .
Viagra falls
The ATB silver 5oz rounds are showing up eBay. OMG some at over $400.00 each! SUCKERS! Apmex was only selling the entire set, not individual 5oz rounds, for a mere $1,395.00 each set. Now that the mint is imposing pricing rules, let's see if they sell individual and/or sets.
Here are the five AP's that purchased coins.
Coins 'N Things
MTB
Jack Hunt Coin Broker
FideliTrade
American Precious Metals Exchange
Looks like Jack already has a big DO NOT CALL message up on the website.
On the 2009 Silver Proof Set mintage of 299K...Is that the mintage for the Complete Silver Proof Set or is that the mintage for the Proof Silver Quarter Set? Can anyone confirm this?
That's just the total for the Silver Quarters Proof Set.
(299,178)
From their web site it looks like Jack Hunt really hates dealing with the public. I wonder how they'll handle these items. If they fail to abide by the rules I hope people alert the Mint and that it comes down hard on them.
How did Coins N Things become an AP? I thought you had to have high-volume and some other pretty strict criteria. Coins N Things looks like a small-scale outfit. They offer only three silver bullion items on their website.
To the poster above ;are you sure your looking at the one in MA or the one in Canada ?
Email from APMEX just now...
We have received instructions from the U.S. Mint regarding the distribution of the 2010 America the Beautiful Silver Bullion Coins. In accordance with those instructions, we have ordered our maximum allocation of 3,000 sets, each set with five coins for the 2010 year. We expect delivery of the coins late next week.
Because the Mint discontinued the program and then relaunched the program with different requirements on distribution of these coins, we have asked the Mint a few questions for which we await the responses so we may fully comply with the new program. Please be patient while we receive clarification on the distribution and we receive the coins we have ordered. We anticipate we will able to provide additional information late next week.
Thank you for your cooperation and understanding in this matter and, as always, we value our relationship with you.
I'm looking at the Canada one. www.coins-n-things.com. That's the URL referenced in the Coin World article. Maybe Coin World posted the wrong URL.
http://www.coinworld.com/News/20101214/Bulletin20101214.aspx
Just as I thought the one your looking for is Coins 'N Things (Massachusetts). Their site is down .
Coin World listed the wrong web site.
Sorry about the truncated URL for the Coin World article. This one should work. It names the five APs who have ordered.
http://tinyurl.com/2acfdmh
RE 4:44
I received the email from APMEX also.
I had ordered 3 sets from them and they charged my CC 12/6.
I'm not sure what questions about distribution they have...price? I wouldn't think so as it is clearly spelled out.
Quantity?...no, 1 set per household
is clearly spelled out.
How about I hold on to your money as long as I can before issuing you a refund for 2 sets plus the difference between what the new sets sell for and what I paid for the other set I should receive.
APMEX, please enlighten me.
The need more time to figure out how they can wriggle their way out of delivering the sets already ordered.
Please correct me if I'm wrong , by everything that I have read , means they are only being sold in 5 coin sets ? Not individually?
As I said in another post in these blogs. I'm happy I bought silver when it was 4.00 an ounce. There is no way in HEdouble hockey sticks that I would fall for all this scamming. To the people who paid 1395.00 to 3100.00 for these sets. You really need to have your head examined.
@ 7:01 PM : I'm with ya on that, and btw I got into silver @ 6.50 an ounce.
There is nothing better than being a coin collector.....unless maybe you're a rich coin collector who needs his head examined.
I got into silver at $12/oz
I got into silver at $3.30 per $1 in junk silver, yet I still ordered a set of 5 oz. hockey pucks for $1395 because they are so neat and I think the dollar will soon be worthless as they are printing trillions of them to pay the bills. I'm selling all my other collectibles (stamps, antiques) and buying silver, gold and platinum. And next year palladium!
Ha @ 7:54 PM ,well said. I got in at 9 bucks oz.
You'll be really happy when silver reaches 100.00 oz., yes that's right , it will.
But very disappointed that you didn't buy any at 30.00 while dogging those who did. You scammed yourself.
You can buy each coin individually on ebay only at this point...Talk about a scam.
I am going to wait on the mint to sell these , at least I'm used to their tactics. Same coins just mint marked , much lower price .I hope!!
Ha! I got into silver @ .20 an oz.
I found a Franklin half in Grandpa's chair when I was a kid.
If you bought silver at $4/oz, great...what did you buy.
If you are so happy, why are you still covering a blog like this?
Do you not think there is still money to be made on modern silver bullion/numismatic coins?
Much lower price ? Don't count on that.
The floor is open ..
Surely they have to be less than $400.00 !!! YIKES
Now I only ordered 1 set from APMEX. I did NOT receive the "We have received instructions from the U.S. Mint regarding the distribution of the 2010 America the Beautiful Silver Bullion Coins." email. So it would seem that only those who ordered more than 1 set will be receiving this.
Did anyone else out there who ordered only 1 set get that e-mail?
APMEX might try to execute all the 1 set orders, and then sort through the bulk orders after that. Of course there is no mention as to price.
Yes, the APMEX email I posted earlier was to me and I only ordered one set.
I receieved the email as well and only ordered one set.
Me too. Just hang tight, your set is coming next week at a discount. They promised delivery in the "delay" email.
I did NOT receive the e-mail and I ordered 15 sets!
I'd rather have the silver than the email....
They are probably asking the Mint to let them make the refund in Roosevelt dimes or whatever they are overstocked with. Their delay and foot dragging in this matter is really going to hurt their future business.
But one thing, if they had not advertised the sets early at $1395 there would have been no blowback to the Mint and the coins would have gone out on the 6th, mainly to dealers and it would have been too late for the Mint to enforce the rules.
APMEX is probably playing ignorant with the US Mint and trying to get them to allow the sales that were made on the 1000 sold out sets stick since there was no stipulation made prior to the sale. The old grandfather Claus tactic. I doubt very seriously this will work. But I'm sure they are doing all they can to keep as much profit as possible. This will without a doubt piss many people off. But business is business. I'm just glad I never ordered anything from anyone regarding these bullion biscuits. Anyone who pays more then 1.65 over spot for bullion is crazy IMHO.
The key here is APMEX sold 1000 sets, not the Mint. The Mint at that point had sold nothing. APMEX felt so sure that everything would work out that they went ahead and took preorders even before they ordered from the Mint. Turns out the negligible risk they assumed was not so negligible. The Mint owes them no special favors here.
The Mint I doubt will budge. They have made themselves eminently clear and I support them. Their function is to mint and disseminate coins and bullion not to encourage perceived rarity and cheap PCGS / TPG hype. Congrats US Mint on a job well done!
The latest word is the mint is only allowing them to sell one coin per order per household, not one set per order.
That adds a lot of shipping and handling charges if someone wants to try and buy all five!
That's nonsense. The rules were spelled out by the mint on the relaunch. If you thought APMEX looked bad, wait until a rule like that gets instituted behind closed doors by the Mint. The Mint is full of fools!
If that is true it would be disastrous for collectors. I have trouble believing they would be that stupid. That would be as big a blunder as APMEX committed with their early sale. Maybe next will be face to face sales only!
"Anyone who pays more then 1.65 over spot for bullion is crazy IMHO."
Yes, but this isn't your typical bullion. Look at the mintage numbers.
Imagine the mint only producing 33,000 2010 silver eagles(bullion).
APMEX was absolutely right in describing the ATB's as a numismatic rarity.
Maybe I'm just crazy, but I really want some of these for my "collection" and am willing to pay much, much more than 1.65 over spot.
Why APMEX has chosen to make their questions to the US Mint a mystery only makes their customers feel uncomfortable about the way their orders will be handled. They have now become much like the US Mint in not allowing paying customers to know the full details of their orders. This in itself does not bode well for APMEX and will only in the end make customers more apprehensive before placing orders with them. Why our US Mint and private businesses have become non-transparent is the true mystery here. I can only sum it all up to deceptive greed. This all needs to change at some point and time. Perhaps this will help open the door for other non-deceptive un-greedy APs to form and give APMEX and others a run for their money.
Maybe Wikileaks will post what is happening!
Reputation is everything. APMEX has clearly put a permanent mark on their rep with the current state of events. The US Mint is actually trying to fix their rep. But customers never forget when they get screwed. So both are marred IMO.
796,813 Proof 2010 ASEs = Toxic Waste. They made to many again. Still thousands available on eBay.
Who in their right mind expected a low mintage on the 2010 ASE proof. The US Mint knew full well that these would be a big seller. That is why the pulled off the APMEX move by charging an outrageous premium on them. The only difference is that they make up their own rules to rip off the public. Maybe one day all the collectors will form a union and strike against these rip off companies by not buying anything from them. But with all the collectors all to willing to get ripped off. I hardly doubt that will ever happen.
OMG ... Item # 130466256821 ..A fool and his money are really soon parted!!
In addition the mint kept the initial ASE mintage secret so the hype took over. I originally planned on buying 25, then down graded that to 5 in the end because of the mint not offering mintages. I figured they were making a million at that point.
Does anyone at the mint actually plan these releases out?
2725.00 is solid proof that the ignorance of man with his money is alive and well on these sets. This is the reason why we will never see a change in the greedy ones out there. If you keep feeding sharks in the ocean more will come. Why can't these ignorant people with their money figure this out. Or is this a set up by authorized TPG dealers to try to establish another unrealistic price guide price for PCGS and NGC? Either way there really must be those out there that believe all the hype falsely created. I just find it incredibly difficult to believe that someone could be so stupid to pay such an outlandish premium for these 5 oz biscuits. 2725.00 equals out to be 109.00 an ounce. HELLOOOOOOO IDIOTS OF THE WORLD WAKE UP !!!!!
Item # 130466256821
private listing - bidders' identities protected US $2,725.00
Dec-16-10 13:21:41 PST
Sure look fishy to me. Only a set up bid with one bidder on the item. I bet that bidders activity level with that seller is quite high. If people actually believe this crap and follow this lead then they deserve to get ripped off IMO.
HAHAHAHAH..SUCKERS
If you think that is bad. You should see the scumbags completed listings. Surely this is proof that either the US Mints plan isn't working or this seller is headed for many negative feedbacks.
Sellers completed listings:
http://completed.shop.ebay.com/greenpaper123/m.html?rt=nc&LH_Complete=1&_fln=1&_trksid=p3911.c0.m283&_rdc=1
What a freakin joke this whole ATB 5 oz coin set has become. So who is the AP responsible for this?
I'm very sure that there are dealers out there that have set up prepaid premiums for anyone willing to buy these sets for them.The secondary market has started to establish the greed that will take place as a result of the ignorance of the fools and their money. The TPGs will then begin to make them an example of the proof for their price guides. Unfortunately this will not be stopped even by the US Mint unless there are laws made with punishments suitable to the crime. And YES IMO this is a crime.
What a fiasco! I just want 1 of the Yellowstone 5 oz'ers . Looks like I won't be getting anything now , at these prices. I just hope the mint version will be around $200 ,then I am in .
The interpretation of public demand for bullion needs to be stated more clearly.The US Mint should take a position to sell to both the public and to APs at the same time. This would create a higher profit for the US Mint which is needed. This would also stop most of the gouging and set prices at a reasonable fixed level that everyone can afford. IMO the US Mint created this fiasco by announcing the mintage of these coins and only selling to the APS first. All mintage should be announced prior to a release if known and the sales should start to both the public an the APs at the same time. The APs should be able to buy at a lower premium then the public because of bulk purchasing. Unfortunately none of this was done in this manner and we all see the chaos that has been created as a result. All of these suggestions would help level the playing field and create a true competitive environment for the collectors and the dealers. Case closed.
The bottom line to this 5 oz bullion horse hockey is when you pick up your weekly copy of Coin World and see the full page ad from your honest injun's down at Chattanooga Coin. Just wait until you spot their "limited edition" quantity available and bargain basement pricing.
Yes Virginia, there once was a Santa Claus. Kool-Aid dear?
33000 bullion versions and 27000 numismatic versions.Not everyone that wants one will get one at this mintage.I personally can not afford a set right now anyway. I'm thinking that waiting for the lower mintage set fits my want list. Because buying gifts for my family right now is way more important than being selfish and using that money to buy a higher mintage set. I really hope the US Mint does not disappoint me with an announcement saying that they will not be selling the numismatic version. But that is a risk I am willing to take to see that my family gets the Merry Christmas they deserve. I hope everyone gets what they want for Christmas. Never have I seen so much greed during a time for giving. This is not what America is all about is it? Didn't we used to be a giving nation? Merry Christmas everyone.
It was probably a Royal Prince in Numismaticstan who bought the set on ebay for $2700ish. Money is not a factor and its way easier to hit the buy it now button than it is to get the whole set from 5 different APs. Numismaticstanis are very very smart...
To: December 16, 2010 7:19 PM
I see these very much like the Gold Spouse coins. Remember the 40000 total sellout on those? Then interest dropped as prices rose causing lower mintages later in the series. To assume anything at this point only may make an ass out of you. You sound like a very bitter person calling people names. Sure you may have an opinion. But to disrespect others for theirs shows your true maturity. To me you sound just like a pissed off flipper who can't get enough sets to meet your greed. Or maybe your just one of the fools who paid 2725.00 for a set of these coins. If you are either one of these type people. I am very positive that you are one of the ones who helped create this mess.
The Flippers are trying to make people believe you can only buy one coin from five different APs. Can you please help clarify this for the collectors Michael? The fact is that full sets will be available to the public by APs. Quit trying to bend the truth to rip people off please.
The comparison to the gold spouse coins is not exactly apples to apples because the spouse coins were not sold as bullion like these coins are.
I believe it is apples and apples because of the lower mintage. This is the first of the series and will obviously sell out just like the first of the series of gold spouse coins sold out. To assume that these will be the key date of the series with this being the first release of the series I believe is a big mistake. It would be the first time in modern bullion coin history that the first in series was the key date. Think about that.
Jeez buddy, your sounding pretty pissed off and bitter yourself. re-read your post. Your bitter and pissed off. Case closed.
What first year bullion coin sold only 33,000? There isn't one until now.
"It would be the first time in modern bullion coin history that the first in series was the key date."
So my '08 W 1/4 oz. fractional Buff doesn't count ?(1st in series)
Or what about my '09 Platinum Proof(1st in series) ?
"Think about that."
I forgot the platinum eagles did sell less than 33,000 the first year for the 1/4 and 1/2 ounce, but that is platinum in 4 different sizes.
These come in two silver sizes, the silver quarters which will do almost 1 million coins and this one that is 33,000 plus the P version at 27,000.
Anyway we will see, I am thinking the mint had only three months to strike these coins and next year depending on demand will have over 9 months to do it. They could do 3 times as many if need be.
The question that I have in my mind is if the US Mint will produce these numismatic version as a proof? If so, will there be proofs sold by the US Mint and Bullion sold by the APs? There was obviously 300,000 ounces total allocated for both versions that have been split in two separate ways. Will the US Mint announce that the 27,000 coins being sold by them become proof numismatic versions? If so, will there be less allocated for the bullion versions later to either match or exceed the possible proof versions? I just don't see a simple P being put on these bullion coins to make them numismatic versions. I may be wrong but this just sounds stupid and lazy to me to just put a P on the same bullion coins to call them numismatic versions. I really believe some more surprises are coming that will put a completely different twist on these series of coins. After all, even Mexico makes bullion and proof 5 ounce coins. I can't see us passing up the opportunity to do the same with our coins. If so are we really being out done by other world mints. I guess if we see nothing but Ps on a bullion coin. The answer to that question is sad but YES.
The P version will have a different finish according to the mint.
So , seriously , are these only going to be sold in sets of 5 ?
I honestly don't think the US Mint can buy enough silver to meet the demand required in the future for this series.I believe that there will be much lower mintage in the future because the amount of demand world wide of silver will not allow for high mintage of this series to be a reality.Lower mintage on this series is inevitable.
Its almost to the point....no check that....its well beyond the point that I smell a conspiracy. There is way too much misinformation going around and a well orchistrated delay to be considered a coincidence. I believe that all parties involved are building hype and gaining a network of free advertising through all of the blogs. We are the instruments being used by Moy and all of the APs to build this once thought blah bullion program into what it has become. I think they are genious in a way, however that doesn't stop me from wanting to contact a lawyer to discuss Apmex's theft of my $1400 bucks. I believe a class action is due and a nice settlement of....lets say....
So , seriously , are these only going to be sold in sets of 5 ?...What do you think ?....
APMEX two days ago had the availability set at 12/17. They also were proudly showing that they had sold out of 1000 sets in 19 hours. Now when you go to their site. All you see is the ad with an alert me option. They contently maintain their answer even as of yesterday. Question to APMEx yesterday. When will these be available? Answer from APMEX: We will know more in 12 to 14 days. What a freakin joke this whole fiasco has become. And yet they still hold every ones money with no answers other then 'We expect delivery some time next week"
"So , seriously , are these only going to be sold in sets of 5 ?...What do you think ?...."
Not necessarily, check on ebay.
For now APX has them in the sets--could change--hang tight. This release has a few twists and turns.
The numismatic version from the Mint may just sell the both ways to get the most out of them.(for the one hour that they'll be available online)
There's no way I'm paying the exorbitant selling prices on Ebay .May just have to sit this one out.
"I think they are genious in a way, however that doesn't stop me from wanting to contact a lawyer to discuss Apmex's theft of my $1400 bucks. I believe a class action is due and a nice settlement of....lets say...."
I'm sure that if you contact APMEX they will be more than happy to cancel your order and refund your money promptly.
He doesn't want to cancel, no way.
Just wants them delivered like they(and the mint)promised.
Me too !
I would live to know what questions APMEX asked the Mint that is holding up their distribution. Maybe it's something helpful to customers like can they sell to relatives. But more likely it's something about how they can make more money off their customers.
Since the Mint is a government agency, probably a Freedom of Information Act request could get a copy of APMEX's letter. Also, would be a good time to ask how they are going to be sure guys like Jack Hunt follow the guidelines and what proof they will require.
Any intrepid reporters out there who want to make the FOIA request to the Mint and be a hero?
I would "LIKE" to know, that is...
I don’t think anyone will be able to buy from the AP’s (Authorized Purchasers) to start with. Due to the restrictions on the selling price, here is what I’m afraid will happen.
AP shows all units sold , never offering any for sale. They are all sold to friends, ETC.. All coins sold back to AP. AP then becomes just another seller and up and up goes the price. Bet no one buys a set at the mint’s guidelines!
to add to the comment above. Ampex questions : Can we as an AP buy the coins we sell back and then sell at market value. The answer according to Federal Law: Yes you can. NO ONE will buy the coins at the mint's price rule!!
A few of the items the AP's are asking for clarification on......
http://www.numismaster.com/ta/numis/Article.jsp?ad=article&ArticleId=16518
Quote : New rules say the authorized companies can only sell ONE COIN OF EACH DESIGN TO A HOUSEHOLD to ensure wide distribution of coins to the public. Yeah , like that's going to happen !! I thinks it's like a cell phone plan ..Friends & family first..
I think all the dealers and distributors need a little cheese with their Wine. Whahhh Whaaahhhh Whahhhhhh!!!! They are finding it difficult to rip off the public. I can promise you that all these dealers and distributors have everything in place to make sure the public gets screwed. I'll wait and buy my set from the US Mint.Screw all these money grubbing greedy hum bug dealers and distributors. Numismaster pretty much made it clear that at least three or four of the greedy suckers are going to do all they can to make these sets completely unreasonable in price to the public. Collectors should wake up and boycott these scumbags.
I'm gonna see what happens here->(atb.cntofma.com) on 1/3/11 at 12:01 am sharp. I hope they're fair(they have to be--there are rules in place) or their will be consequences.
I'm sure the friends and families are already on their sold out list.
>A few of the items the AP's are >asking for clarification on......
>http://www.numismaster.com/ta/numis
I just read this article. What pathetic rubbish! All of this started with APMEX's price gouging. Then the Mint rightfully stepped in. There's a big difference between reasonable profit (for bullion) and sky high premiums (for preconceived rarity). Now the dealers want to check our citizenship papers to make a purchase of the ATB. Wow!
The mint never said they could only sell 1 coin per household - they said 1 coin per design per household, which means only 1 set of all 5 coins per household. Big difference.
Presumably they could make a few extra $'s by only selling them individually...
Why on Earth would APMEX ask if they must sell to US citizens? Maybe they are planning to fly someone down to Mexico or Switzerland to open 100 PO boxes? With $100,000+ profit to be made on each 100 sets, I bet a lot of tricks will be tried. I wonder how many people will end up in jail all because of these coins. Greed is a strong emotion. It's not a crime to break the contract but it will be a crime when they try to cover their tracks when the Mint starts checking into it.
Too bad the Mint didn't supply numbered certificates with each set. They when some dealer comes to a coin show with 100 sets to sell for $2500 each we'd know exactly where they came from.
I just thought I'd throw my two cents worth in on APMEX's Ad for the ATB 5 oz coins.
The much anticipated United States of America the Beautiful Silver Bullion Coin™ Program has almost begun!! Start your collection off right with the very 1st rip off coin of the series, Hot Springs National Park, Arkansas. Nearly an exact replica of the Hot Springs National Park Quarter Dollar newly released in 2010! Above and beyond any reasonable price for bullion.
Set an "Alert Me / Screw Me" now and be scammed when we begin selling these fabulous coins! This is one of the most talked about United States Mint Bullion products ever released because we have complete caused a fiasco by over charging on bullion coins and we expect to sell out quickly and have our shipment stopped. If you would like to become one of the first to get completely hosed on this series, set your "Alert Me and Screw me" NOW!
Here is a little proof that people have completely lost their minds on the sales of these BULLION coins.
http://completed.shop.ebay.com/i.html?rt=nc&LH_Complete=1&_nkw=America%20the%20Beautiful%20Silver%20Bullion%20Coin&_fln=1&_trksid=p3286.c0.m283&_rdc=1
Waiting this one out is an obvious smart move with this holiday presale craziness. Keep in mind that no one can promise delivery at this point. I'm just wondering who some of the sellers are and are they already on the friends and family list.
They are obviously showing that they are buying more then one per household. Looks very much like the APs and dealers have been busy getting their ducks all in a row to screw the decision made by the US Mint and the average collector. I hope the APs involved in this obvious evidence against them loose their account with the Mint over this mess.
Looks like the insane 2700.00 price has averaged out down 1000.00 to 1700.00. This is making the future lower mintage Numismatic version look much more appealing. I personally will not give any of these greedy dealers or APs the satisfaction of gouging me on these bullion coins. Just keep in mind that when the lower mintage numismatic lower price is put out by the US Mint. The price of these coins will not hold a candle to the current insanity prices.
Lower prices from the Mint ?
That simply will not happen.
Yes, they are in this for the money.
I know a collector who is in the FBI and he says they're going to keep an eye on this and if any of the APs break the rules they'll be fighting with Bernie Madoff in the shower over who picks up the soap!
Director of United States Mint Resigns .. Yeeeaaaahhhh.
A message I just received from APMEX indicates my one set order will be sent on 12-24-10. Cost is $859.95 + 45.75 shipping.
... $46 for shipping a tiny little roll of coins? DID THEY NOT GET THE MESSAGE TO STOP PRICE GOUGING?
I ordered 2 sets and got one ...cost 859.95 and Shipping 19.95...with a refund check...shipping Arrival? Friday Dec 24
I got the email too with $19.95 shipping. But I paid by check. Did you guys with $46 shipping pay by credit card? I think APMEX always charges higher shipping when you choose to use a credit card. It costs them at least $26 more in fees if you prefer to use plastic to pay them $860 than to send a check. And you probably get cash back or bonus points on your credit card.
Yes, that's gotta be a credit card charge- I think they add about 3% to your total.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Wow, 5:24 must have been really bad. That rarely happens!
I just want ONE coaster , not the whole set of 5 !
Michael,
Do you have a list of APs that are set up to sell directly to the public through the internet the ATB 5 oz coins. So far all I know is APMEX claims to know nothing until they furnish the details through their alert me now feature and C&T is saying that their sales will start on their new web site on Jan 3rd.. Do you know anything more or does anyone else?
Apmex did make a statement to me that they will buy as many as possible of the ATBs and did not say anything about a possible additional order other then the fact that buyers have already received information saying that their orders ordered from the sell out will be delivered by the 24th. I take that news as a sign that they have received their first allocation order.
All this secrecy is just making me wonder if these coins will even be available to anyone other then through the secondary markets. What are your feelings about this situation and do you have any other additional facts to share?
The latest information I have on the ATB Silver Bullion coins is that nine of the eleven AP's have purchased their allotments.
All of the AP's except Scotia Mocatta and Commerzbank have ordered.
As far as I know, there have not been any changes to the terms and conditions set by the US Mint.
This means that the nine participating AP's must sell directly to the public at a maximum premium of 10%, with an order limit of one coin of each design per household.
Unfortunately, I don't have any information on the individual distribution plans of the nine AP's.
That leaves two orders left. The question is will APMEX and C&T be the ones that make those two last orders? It is safe to assume that all these APs have well over 3300 customers that they can fill these orders with without having to set up any additional web site to make the sales happen.
With the latest news of Ed Moys resignation. I really can't help but wonder what all this ATB business has to do with his resignation. He has only lasted two years with a democratic president and was appointed by a republican president.
Is this a push by the lame duck congress to get a handle on the US Mint before the new republican house takes over?
Many politicians I am sure are tied to the interests of coins sales. Is this a move to make the business as usual robin hood administration take over the US Mint? Or to take out the larger money makers and institute a more governmental run sales program through the US Mint?
Guys- just talked to the US Mint on the phone- they said they will be selling the coins directly through the Mint starting in January at "much lower prices" than everybody else is selling them for. She said they didn't have the details yet, but that they would be selling them. -woodward/bernstein
there is an article in coin world week of dec 20,it says don't be fooled by 5 ounce america the beautiful series. the article says if you ever think you will get more out of a dealer in the years to come other than melt value,you are fooling yourself.This has happened to me with other bullion coins in the past ,when i went to sell them. i think it is really a good article on how alot of purchases prices work and then when you go too sell it is a different story. these things are 5oz silver rounds and that is it , the hype has then built up know,but years to come there are going to be some long sad faces.
The 5 ounce ATB coins are priced at 34.40 per ounce ($860 for a set of 5) by APMEX. The current American Silver Eagle one ounce coin is priced at 33.50 per ounce on APMEX. There are 33.9 million American Silver Eagle 1 ounce bullion coins available in 2010 (and counting). There are 33,000 ATB silver bullion coins available (final mintage). You are paying a 2.7% premium on the 5 ounce ATB coins while getting something over 1000 times scarcer. Supply and demand will rule the day in the end. It will be easy to determine the aftermarket winner by simply comparing the price of the ASE to the ATB coins on a per ounce basis. We'll see if the coins are truly just considered "bullion" by the market.
6:23 Well said...these are not your ordinary "bullion coins"
One must understand the fact that other such five ounce bullion pieces from other countries with a mintage of only 1000 or even less can sell for bullion spot prices. I guess that kind of blows that theory.
Quite honestly I do believe the idiots and their money may keep these selling for more in the beginning only do to hype in the market place.
But. the prices and availability will remain until the novelty wears off. The prices will simply at that point reflect upon spot. This is because this product is merely nothing but bullion.
It's supply AND demand, not just supply. Other countries' bullion does not have the demand that US bullion does. Economics 101. You'll see it in action once the initial price fixing has passed. The market will dictate the price thereafter.
I wouldn't be so quick to say the idiots and their money are the market or the gougers and their starting prices should dictate the market.
The US Mint may be holding the holy grail of the first 5 ATBs with a lower mintage which will be called numismatic versions. As soon as these are released interest and demand will shift and the AP bullion will become what they are BULLION.
You may want to study the market better on bullion before you are so quick to get arrogant about how well these bullion coins will do just because they are American.
The fact that these coins are shrouded now with negative exposure will not bode well on their future prices. What you are witnessing now is the same thing that happens on many new series coins. People pay to much because they believe the hype and are sorry later. The choice is clearly yours to make. I'll wait for the numismatic version myself.
The APs will make $297,000.00 off of the one order they make. There plan was to make $2,062,500.00. This is why the US Mint called this gouging. Now it looks like the APs are figuring out ways to increase their profits regardless of what the US Mint has made them commit to. It's all about the greed factor any more. What ever happened to the honesty in collecting? When is enough enough? If every set sold in the after market at $2700.00. That would be a gross profit of $6,352,500.00 for one order of 3300 sets. When you look at it in these terms. Then you begin to see just how big a rip off this is on the public. It would also remain a loss that no one in the public would recover from.GET IT NOW!!!
EVERYONE ORDERING THESE SETS FROM APMEX - USE PROMO CODE "imadethelist2010" WHEN YOU PLACE YOUR ORDER AND YOU WILL GET $5 OFF OF THE PRICE! LETS SPREAD THE WORD ABOUT THIS PROMO AND MAKE SURE WE KEEP ATLEAST ANOTHER $5 FROM APMEX OVER THESE SETS!
If you buy something for 2700 that you can buy for 860 then the buyer is a fool, but what does that make the buyers of the coins at 860 that are only paying a 2.7% premium over American silver eagles? Considering the ATBs are 1000 times more scarce, I am willing to risk overpaying by 2.7%. It would seem you are being foolish by saying the public is being ripped off by extrapolating the highest price to everyone. Not everyone is paying 2700, some very smart people are buying at less than 35 per ounce on something that will be very scarce.
There is no doubting that the numismatic versions will be winners too.
The true insanity has now begun on these plastic slabbed rip offs. 3999.99 for a full set of NGC slabbed coins. If anyone pays this. They need to have their heads examined.
Feebay listing # 270683092749
Cherry picking already! Wonder how the Mint feels about this?
I can already hear the reasons for these scammers for the high premiums. But a ms70 is a low population BLAH BLAH BLAH !!!
What a joke these scammers have become.
It really messes up the hobby of coin collecting doesn't it!
I'd be more than happy to get just a set in the RAW format.
The APs are clearly making it impossible for the public to buy these coins. What if anything is the US Mint doing about this?
Does any AP's have those for sale to public? what good the US mint did by telling them to sell it to public,i donot see any for sale or maybe i am blind.
Yes, it looks like the Mint destroyed any hope of the public getting these coins by intervening in the market and attempting to price fix.
What about those of us who don't want the whole set ? They aren't making single coins available to us !!!
What about those of us who don't want the whole set ? They aren't making single coins available to us !!!
Uhhh....Buy the whole set, sell what you don't want for a profit thereby reducing the cost of the one coin you want. If you are averse to making a profit, sell the excess coins at cost or sell for a profit and donate it to charity.
Post a Comment
Subscribe to Post Comments [Atom]
<< Home